Albany Law

[Dane96]

Why does Albany Law School need UAlbany to become a public law school? It could easily become a public school without any affiliation with UAlbany. Albany Law will easily survive the current economic "crisis". Albany law could easily associate with Stony Brook, Binghamton or RPI.

 

What? Seriously. I really just don't understand your argument...at all. Why would they "affiliate" with two public schools further from UA, and with a private school that focuses on Engineering.

 

You really aren't thinking right now. Sorry to be harsh...but this is just bad business you are preaching.

[Dane96]

Albany Law does not need to affiliate with anyone. It will survive and do fine just as it always has. It will continue to produce attorneys who will lead private and public entities. As far as I know UAlbany initiated the conversation with Albany Law.

 

If Govenor Cuomo wants another public law school he can make it happen without any affiliation. Some legislation, a few agreements and Albany Law becomes a public school.

 

Penn State affiliated with Dickinson School of Law. They are separated by 200 miles. Binghamton has publicly sought a law school component for a long time. Why couldn't that happen?

 

The idea of a stand alone public law school isn't hard to imagine. Why affiliate it with any of the university centers? That just insures that Stony Brook will get a medical school and Binghamton will get something else.

 

Albany Law will continue to operate autonomously with a lot of public funding.

 

I have a better question: If they are going to affiliate with another school, why not Albany. Frankly, I don't understand your disparaging view towards UA...because that is exactly what your comments lean towards.

[Dane96]

But, from what I can see he has never represented a client. The idea that he is going to train lawyers to represent people who are actually prosecuting or defending accused people is preposterous. Would you let a doctor who did population studies but never treated a patient treat you for cancer?

 

Ummmm...this is exactly what goes on at most law and B schools in the country. The majority of Professors are academics...not practicioners.

[Eli]

Yeah, I don't understand the Bing or SB thing either...what the hell would that accomplish? Why would you not affiliate with the biggest university in the area

Albany Law does not need to affiliate with anyone. It will survive and do fine just as it always has. It will continue to produce attorneys who will lead private and public entities. As far as I know UAlbany initiated the conversation with Albany Law.

 

If Govenor Cuomo wants another public law school he can make it happen without any affiliation. Some legislation, a few agreements and Albany Law becomes a public school.

 

Penn State affiliated with Dickinson School of Law. They are separated by 200 miles. Binghamton has publicly sought a law school component for a long time. Why couldn't that happen?

 

The idea of a stand alone public law school isn't hard to imagine. Why affiliate it with any of the university centers? That just insures that Stony Brook will get a medical school and Binghamton will get something else.

 

Albany Law will continue to operate autonomously with a lot of public funding.

 

I have a better question: If they are going to affiliate with another school, why not Albany. Frankly, I don't understand your disparaging view towards UA...because that is exactly what your comments lean towards.

 

[Underpar]

I'm not disparaging UAlbany at all. I am a proud graduate. I think a merger between the two schools could be great for both.

 

My concern is with Albany Law, from which I am also a proud graduate. Not too many years ago Albany Law was considered the hidden jewel of New York State's law schools. For almost 20 years Albany Law lead every school in bar passage rate. 93% of my classmates passed the bar exam on our first try. The school was lead by people who had a close personal attachment. The professors were fabulous. They did not teach law, they guided students through an incredibly difficult but rewarding process of learning how to read, think, write and speak like lawyers. We learned very quickly, in fact on the first day of classes, to never expect a professor to answer a question about a legal issue. If you did ask a question you could expect to be asked to stand before all of your classmates and grilled, sometimes for 15 or 20 minutes. The reason for this was simple and powerful. We were being trained to think and speak for ourselves and to not rely on anyone else to answer the legal question you had. We were being trained in the art of identifying the correct issues and to reason towards the best answer. We were being trained to take a position and defend it with proper analysis. We were being trained to stand on our own feet.

 

The law school has lost its way. It is more important for a professor to publish material than to guide her students through the three year process of reshaping their brains. Students can now get 3 credit hours for taking a survey course on Chinese Law which will be of absolutely no value and will not advance the process of training students to think like lawyers.

 

There is no comparison between a great law school education and an undergraduate education at UAlbany or any other undergraduate school.

 

My heartfelt concern is that if Albany Law does not get back on track it will slip further and further away from the formula which once made it so successful. The school needs to be lead by real accomplished lawyers who have a strong emotional connection to it.

 

[purplenorange]

My heartfelt concern is that if Albany Law does not get back on track it will slip further and further away from the formula which once made it so successful. The school needs to be lead by real accomplished lawyers who have a strong emotional connection to it.

 

No argument that Albany Law has to get back on track. But it's so far off track that it needs a new direction. I wasn't suggesting that the Rockefeller faculty should be teaching at the law school, but that the law school is a good fit with both Rockefeller and the Business School. Joint JD/MBA and JD/MPA degrees will be popular for people who want to primarily pursue non-legal professions but want the training. This will help strengthen the student body at ALS. Yes, this can be done through a looser 'affiliation', but somehow it never happens.

 

In terms of medical, it'd be great to somehow / someway grab Downstate. I don't think that'll happen, but I can hope (I'm in the med. research field, so have more of a passion for the sciences). The fact that it's in NYC doesn't really matter -- medical schools are, for whatever reason, often not co-located with main campuses. Cornell is a prime example and there are others. Stony Brook and Buffalo both have medical schools. Wow - if both ALS and Downstate can happen for UA...... AAU would definitely be in the cards..

[danefan]

The devil is always in the detail. I actually think this could be a very good development for both institutions. I have just looked at Professor Acker's credentials. He is a very impressive man. But, from what I can see he has never represented a client. The idea that he is going to train lawyers to represent people who are actually prosecuting or defending accused people is preposterous. Would you let a doctor who did population studies but never treated a patient treat you for cancer?

 

You have an over-inflated view of Albany Law professor's credentials. Albany Law's star crim law professor is a pure academic himself.

 

And again. The argument is moot. No one is saying your dumping professors.

[danefan]

I'm not disparaging UAlbany at all. I am a proud graduate. I think a merger between the two schools could be great for both.

 

My concern is with Albany Law, from which I am also a proud graduate. Not too many years ago Albany Law was considered the hidden jewel of New York State's law schools. For almost 20 years Albany Law lead every school in bar passage rate. 93% of my classmates passed the bar exam on our first try. The school was lead by people who had a close personal attachment. The professors were fabulous. They did not teach law, they guided students through an incredibly difficult but rewarding process of learning how to read, think, write and speak like lawyers. We learned very quickly, in fact on the first day of classes, to never expect a professor to answer a question about a legal issue. If you did ask a question you could expect to be asked to stand before all of your classmates and grilled, sometimes for 15 or 20 minutes. The reason for this was simple and powerful. We were being trained to think and speak for ourselves and to not rely on anyone else to answer the legal question you had. We were being trained in the art of identifying the correct issues and to reason towards the best answer. We were being trained to take a position and defend it with proper analysis. We were being trained to stand on our own feet.

 

The law school has lost its way. It is more important for a professor to publish material than to guide her students through the three year process of reshaping their brains. Students can now get 3 credit hours for taking a survey course on Chinese Law which will be of absolutely no value and will not advance the process of training students to think like lawyers.

 

There is no comparison between a great law school education and an undergraduate education at UAlbany or any other undergraduate school.

 

My heartfelt concern is that if Albany Law does not get back on track it will slip further and further away from the formula which once made it so successful. The school needs to be lead by real accomplished lawyers who have a strong emotional connection to it.

 

What year did you graduate from Albany Law?

 

Law Schools haven't been led by real accomplished lawyers in a long time. I agree that is what Albany Law needs though.

[Underpar]

I graduated from Albany Law in 1979. There were only a few pure academics on the faculty. The great late David Siegel was an academic and a fabulous lawyer. But, the faculty was mainly composed of great practicing attorneys. Too much of the current faculty are academics who have never really practiced law. My main concern with a possible merger is that the law school will be pushed further into the publish or perish mode. I want Albany Law graduates to be known as really smart people who can tackle the tough legal problems people and organizations are faced with. I would be fine with a total merger if the main objective was to produce great lawyers. I would be more than disappointed if the goal was to produce lawyers who didn't have a clue as to how to advise someone faced with an important legal challenge.

[Dane96]

Graduates of law school will be known as really smart people based on merit, and not what they learn in school.

 

LSAT does not equal prep for law school.

Law School helps teach a person how to think-- not to do. Law School does not equal prep for the bar.

Bar exam passage does not equate to being able to practice.

[Underpar]

If you don't learn how to think like a lawyer you will never have much merit as a lawyer. Law school is an intensive 3 year program training a person to think like a lawyer. I have no real comment on the LSAT exam except you need to do well to get into law school. When you are selling a product its not bad if you can say that 93% of your graduates pass the bar exam on their first try. What does it say if only 65% of your graduates pass the bar on their first try? It says, not a good law school and not very bright students. You cannot practice law without passing the bar exam.

[uofalbany]

No offense, but I'm not concerned with anything but upgrading the University of Albany and in turn, the positive effects it will have

on the UAlbany athletic program. If they merge, my degree looks that much more attractive. And as important to me now..... the

university upgrading in stature will ultimately help our football and basketball programs.

 

And I absolutely agree with DF, as I have no sympathy for a student to take on massive student loan debt for a law degree....

or for a BA and MA. I transferred from a private college due to personal reasons, and saved a boatload by graduating at UA.

[Oldtimer]

Bottom Line---500 students can't support a school, private or public, and the State is NOT going to take on the cost of a single degree school when it doesn't support the SUNY/CUNY systems.

I think all the benefits are in favor of Albany Law--more social opportunities, athletics, possible lower costs , etc. As a retired Town & Village Justice after 25 years, I think it is hard for many to recoup the cost of the degree. Maybe the education could be the same but the cost less as an affiliate of UAlbany.

[Underpar]

i have it on very reliable authority that the affiliation/merger with Albany Law School is being well received by Albany Law alums and the faculty.

[Clickclack]

i have it on very reliable authority that the affiliation/merger with Albany Law School is being well received by Albany Law alums and the faculty.

 

Is it a merger or affiliation?