CAA Staying Together

[Dane Pound]

I'm not as opposed to the NEC as a lot of other people here. I just want it to get better and I think it will (it has since we've joined.) I don't think we're alone in the conference either, it looks like CCSU and Monmouth have similar goals, not sure about who else in the conference wants to move up but there are probably others.

 

I think the auto-bid is huge. I think we get that and replace St. Francis and Wagner with our AE breathern UNH and Maine and we have a pretty good conference.

[danefan]

<br />I'm not as opposed to the NEC as a lot of other people here. I just want it to get better and I think it will (it has since we've joined.) I don't think we're alone in the conference either, it looks like CCSU and Monmouth have similar goals, not sure about who else in the conference wants to move up but there are probably others.<br /><br />I think the auto-bid is huge. I think we get that and replace St. Francis and Wagner with our AE breathern UNH and Maine and we have a pretty good conference.<br />

<br /><br /><br />

 

See therein lies the problem with the NEC. There is dead weight with schools like St Francis and Sacred Heart who continue to play DIII football in a DI conference, very much like we used to do.

 

Teams like UNH and Maine have no reason to want to be associated with a conference like the NEC and never will.

 

The NEC is well positioned to create a top notch FCS conference but the voting members don't want that.

[uofalbany]

<br />I'm not as opposed to the NEC as a lot of other people here. I just want it to get better and I think it will (it has since we've joined.) I don't think we're alone in the conference either, it looks like CCSU and Monmouth have similar goals, not sure about who else in the conference wants to move up but there are probably others.<br /><br />I think the auto-bid is huge. I think we get that and replace St. Francis and Wagner with our AE breathern UNH and Maine and we have a pretty good conference.<br />

<br /><br /><br />

 

See therein lies the problem with the NEC. There is dead weight with schools like St Francis and Sacred Heart who continue to play DIII football in a DI conference, very much like we used to do.

 

Teams like UNH and Maine have no reason to want to be associated with a conference like the NEC and never will.

 

The NEC is well positioned to create a top notch FCS conference but the voting members don't want that.

 

Does it need to be a unanimous vote in the NEC, with all voting members needing to vote YES to approve increases in scholarships?

 

How about the America East?

Would all schools need to vote YES to start America East football?

Would Maine, New Hampshire, and SBU have interest?

It would be 4 schools that already play FCS football.

[danefan]

<br />I'm not as opposed to the NEC as a lot of other people here. I just want it to get better and I think it will (it has since we've joined.) I don't think we're alone in the conference either, it looks like CCSU and Monmouth have similar goals, not sure about who else in the conference wants to move up but there are probably others.<br /><br />I think the auto-bid is huge. I think we get that and replace St. Francis and Wagner with our AE breathern UNH and Maine and we have a pretty good conference.<br />

<br /><br /><br />

 

See therein lies the problem with the NEC. There is dead weight with schools like St Francis and Sacred Heart who continue to play DIII football in a DI conference, very much like we used to do.

 

Teams like UNH and Maine have no reason to want to be associated with a conference like the NEC and never will.

 

The NEC is well positioned to create a top notch FCS conference but the voting members don't want that.

 

Does it need to be a unanimous vote in the NEC, with all voting members needing to vote YES to approve increases in scholarships?

 

How about the America East?

Would all schools need to vote YES to start America East football?

Would Maine, New Hampshire, and SBU have interest?

It would be 4 schools that already play FCS football.

 

I don't know if needs to be a unanimous vote. But I don't think Albany or Duquesne even gets a vote. Generally, associate members don't get votes on conference issues like scholarship limits.

 

New Hampshire has no interest in moving away from its affiliation with UMass. Get UMass and you may have UNH. Maine is probably in the same boat.

 

SBU would likely jump on board to save money.

 

Its not going to happen though. The only way teams like UNH and Maine are going to leave the CAA is if the NCAA forces a split of the CAA or if they decide they don't want to make the financial committment to playing top-level FCS football anymore. There is absolutely no reason for UNH to move away from the CAA unless financial reason require it, which doesn't appear to be the case.

[uofalbany]

As for AE football, I would assume there wouldn't be enough votes. If UNH and Maine have no interest, then they wouldn't vote for it. Therefore, there will be no AE football.

 

As for NEC football, it will stay at 40 rides for a long long time.

 

Therefore, we are stuck at half scholarship football.

 

Unless, we go Independent.

 

Besides not having an Auto-bid, what are the disadvantages of being independent?

 

One advantage would be that we can MAXIMIZE, going full scholarship.

We can schedule any opponent that we want.

 

As I recall, someone here said that SCHEDULING as an Independent would be difficult to do.

Personally, I don't see how it would be difficult to do.

[danefan]

As for AE football, I would assume there wouldn't be enough votes. If UNH and Maine have no interest, then they wouldn't vote for it. Therefore, there will be no AE football.

 

As for NEC football, it will stay at 40 rides for a long long time.

 

Therefore, we are stuck at half scholarship football.

 

Unless, we go Independent.

 

Besides not having an Auto-bid, what are the disadvantages of being independent?

 

One advantage would be that we can MAXIMIZE, going full scholarship.

We can schedule any opponent that we want.

 

As I recall, someone here said that SCHEDULING as an Independent would be difficult to do.

Personally, I don't see how it would be difficult to do.

 

The biggest disadvantage of going Indy is the old saying that you have nothing to play for. The problem with that is that in FCS football, as long as you are eligible for the playoffs, you have something to play for, conference or not. With that being said, having an AQ is a HUGE recruiting tool. Leaving the NEC with nothing on the horizon as far as conference affiliation wouldn't be the way to go unless you have a set plan to move to 63 rides ASAP and you have some big name FBS games on the schedule. You have to be able to recruit.

 

The discussion of scheduling comes up because you have no guaranteed games on a yearly basis and thus it creates much more work for the athletic department. You could still schedule NEC teams but some may be hesitant to do so if you have more rides than them. Look at us and Stony Brook. Ford said he wouldn't play SBU again until we had 50 or scholarships. It would be a recruiting nightmare to put yourselves in a game as an underdog against a team that used to be a rivalry. And lets face it - on a going forward basis, as long as we are in the NEC and SBU is in the Big South with 63 rides - Albany will be the underdog in that game 8 out of 10 years. I think Monmouth and CCSU would be feeling the same way about an Indy Albany as we do about SBU.

 

You'd be able to find CAA games, but once we started beating the Hofstra and Towsons on a regular basis that scheduling would likely dry up.

 

And Indy schedule could be:

 

 

6 NEC/Patriot/Ivy/PFL

2 Big South/MEAC

3 CAA

1 FBS

 

Definitely doable, but I think it would be difficult to get more than 4 or 5 home games a year since we wouldn't be able to pay any teams to play us.

 

A better option than going Indy is the Big South. 63 rides allowed and an AQ starting in 2010.

 

There are a lot of advantages to being in the Big South if you can handle the travel budget. Liberty has a national TV contract on Family Net. Charleston Southern opens up next year at BCS champs Florida. VMI has great tradition. Coastal Carolina is in Myrtle Beach (I like Golf).

 

However, it doesn't make too much sense from a marketing standpoint. Now if they'd change the name to the Big America Conference or something like that it would be better.

[uofalbany]

As I wrote my last post, I was totally forgetting about the Big South option.

And in fact, I like that option the best.

I'm trying to work at the same time.

 

SB went independent for 2 years while waiting to join the Big South.

 

I assume we'd have a 2 year period before we could start in that conference as well, so...

 

would it be wise to go independent, increase to 63 rides IMMEDIATELY, and start building the

UAlbany FCS football powerhouse.... while waiting

 

OR

 

stay in the NEC for the 2 years and move into the Big South without a transition period through

independence?

[UAalum72]

The problem with indy scheduling isn't the number of teams, but when - it's OK in September, but most leagues are almost exclusively in conference for the last 7 or 8 weeks of the season

[danefan]

As I wrote my last post, I was totally forgetting about the Big South option.

And in fact, I like that option the best.

I'm trying to work at the same time.

 

SB went independent for 2 years while waiting to join the Big South.

 

I assume we'd have a 2 year period before we could start in that conference as well, so...

 

would it be wise to go independent, increase to 63 rides IMMEDIATELY, and start building the

UAlbany FCS football powerhouse.... while waiting

 

OR

 

stay in the NEC for the 2 years and move into the Big South without a transition period through

independence?

 

The transition period for SBU wasn't required by the Big South. SBU wasn't offered the Big South spot until after they went Indy. They got out of the NEC to ramp up scholarships and were intending on staying Indy if they had to.

 

My ideal situation (without considering the CAA or AEast Football) would see us win the NEC AQ in 2010 at the 36 scholarship max. (2 a year to 40 is the NEC rule now). In 2011 you add 10 scholarships (to 46) with players that can play right away and jump to the Big South, adding 10 a year until you max out in 2013 with 63 and two FBS games on the schedule right away in 2013. Pick up a big paycheck to cover the Big South travel costs and hopefully compete for the Big South championship right away.

[danefan]

There is another thing on that keeps nagging my brain:

 

What happens to UAlbany football if RPI decides to use their beautiful new complex to move their athletics to DI?

 

They'd likely be guaranteed a spot in the Patriot League and would instantly begin to dominate recruiting, marketing and fan base strictly because of their resources. There is no way Albany could compete from the NEC in the Capital Distrcit with a DI RPI in the Patriot League.

 

This can't happen over night. There is a moratorium on schools moving to DI that won't be lifted until 2012 and then there is a 4 year (or 5) transition period. So realistically, it couldn't happen until 2016 at the earliest. But they would be recruiting DI athletes and playing a predominantly DI schedule in the transition years. (See Bryant for an example).

[uofalbany]

The problem with indy scheduling isn't the number of teams, but when - it's OK in September, but most leagues are almost exclusively in conference for the last 7 or 8 weeks of the season

 

Very good point 72. It would be difficult to schedule late season game. I guess it could be done though.

If going Independent was the only other option to staying in the NEC, I would choose Independent.

 

 

There is another thing on that keeps nagging my brain:

 

What happens to UAlbany football if RPI decides to use their beautiful new complex to move their athletics to DI?

 

They'd likely be guaranteed a spot in the Patriot League and would instantly begin to dominate recruiting, marketing and fan base strictly because of their resources. There is no way Albany could compete from the NEC in the Capital Distrcit with a DI RPI in the Patriot League.

 

This can't happen over night. There is a moratorium on schools moving to DI that won't be lifted until 2012 and then there is a 4 year (or 5) transition period. So realistically, it couldn't happen until 2016 at the earliest. But they would be recruiting DI athletes and playing a predominantly DI schedule in the transition years. (See Bryant for an example).

 

I have thought once or twice about the same things, df.

 

If rpi wanted to move to FCS football, and we stayed in the NEC at 40 scholarship without a new football facility, we might be vulnerable. If we move to the Big South, and go FULL scholly, I think we are fine. If we move to the Big South, go FULL scholly, and have a stadium, we are a rolling ball of thunder!

 

What kind of course offerings does rpi have, other than engineering?

 

They can't touch UAlbany when it comes to course and program diversity.

After all, most FCS college football players aren't playing professional football, although some do.

They also need a good education and having a large number of programs to select from, helps UAlbany.

[danefan]

The problem with indy scheduling isn't the number of teams, but when - it's OK in September, but most leagues are almost exclusively in conference for the last 7 or 8 weeks of the season

 

Very good point 72. It would be difficult to schedule late season game. I guess it could be done though.

If going Independent was the only other option to staying in the NEC, I would choose Independent.

 

 

There is another thing on that keeps nagging my brain:

 

What happens to UAlbany football if RPI decides to use their beautiful new complex to move their athletics to DI?

 

They'd likely be guaranteed a spot in the Patriot League and would instantly begin to dominate recruiting, marketing and fan base strictly because of their resources. There is no way Albany could compete from the NEC in the Capital Distrcit with a DI RPI in the Patriot League.

 

This can't happen over night. There is a moratorium on schools moving to DI that won't be lifted until 2012 and then there is a 4 year (or 5) transition period. So realistically, it couldn't happen until 2016 at the earliest. But they would be recruiting DI athletes and playing a predominantly DI schedule in the transition years. (See Bryant for an example).

 

I have thought once or twice about the same things, df.

 

If rpi wanted to move to FCS football, and we stayed in the NEC at 40 scholarship without a new football facility, we might be vulnerable. If we move to the Big South, and go FULL scholly, I think we are fine. If we move to the Big South, go FULL scholly, and have a stadium, we are a rolling ball of thunder!

 

What kind of course offerings does rpi have, other than engineering?

 

They can't touch UAlbany when it comes to course and program diversity.

After all, most FCS college football players aren't playing professional football, although some do.

They also need a good education and having a large number of programs to select from, helps UAlbany.

 

 

RPI is one of the most highly respected undergrad institutions in the country. I think you'd be hard pressed to compare academics at UA to RPI.

 

In 2007, RPI was ranked as one of 25 "New Ivies" by Newsweek

http://www.newsweek.com/id/39401

 

From wiki:

 

RPI has five schools: the School of Architecture, the School of Engineering, the School of Humanities and Social Sciences, the Lally School of Management & Technology, and the School of Science. The School of Engineering is the largest by enrollment, followed by the School of Science, the School of Management, the School of Humanities and Social Sciences, and the School of Architecture. There also exists an interdisciplinary program in Information Technology that began in the late 1990s, programs in prehealth and prelaw, Reserve Officers' Training Corps (ROTC) for students desiring commissions as officers in the armed forces, a program in Cooperative Education (Co-Op), and domestic and international exchange programs. All together, the university offers around 140 degree programs in nearly 60 fields that lead to bachelor's, master's, and doctoral degrees.

[uofalbany]

Their academic offerings are more significant than I initially thought.

Didn't realize that they have 5k undergrads either.

 

I don't think rpi poses any threat to UAlbany football, as long as UAlbany continues to progress.

 

Is it rumored that they want to move to D1 football?

 

Is it accurate that their new football facility has only 4800 seats?

[danefan]

Their academic offerings are more significant than I initially thought.

Didn't realize that they have 5k undergrads either.

 

I don't think rpi poses any threat to UAlbany football, as long as UAlbany continues to progress.

 

Is it rumored that they want to move to D1 football?

 

Is it accurate that their new football facility has only 4800 seats?

 

And you are correct - if UAlbany continues to progress. Which is the big "if" here.

 

 

I haven't heard any rumours from the RPI side, but I have heard it from the Patriot League expansion side of things. I'm not sure about the capacity of their new football facility, but I am sure it will be vastly superior to what we currently have. Small for Patriot League standards? probably (although 1 million times better than Georgetown). But much much much nicer than University Field.

[ATL_DANE]

There is another thing on that keeps nagging my brain:

 

What happens to UAlbany football if RPI decides to use their beautiful new complex to move their athletics to DI?

 

They'd likely be guaranteed a spot in the Patriot League and would instantly begin to dominate recruiting, marketing and fan base strictly because of their resources. There is no way Albany could compete from the NEC in the Capital Distrcit with a DI RPI in the Patriot League.

 

This can't happen over night. There is a moratorium on schools moving to DI that won't be lifted until 2012 and then there is a 4 year (or 5) transition period. So realistically, it couldn't happen until 2016 at the earliest. But they would be recruiting DI athletes and playing a predominantly DI schedule in the transition years. (See Bryant for an example).

 

 

That would be a disaster for UA.

 

As I said before, football is the only way UA is getting out of the shadows and gaining some national name recognition. It's going to be hard to get name recognition while being in a modest conference like the AE. Basketball is a very crowded field. None of the other sports have the draw of basketball and football. That only leaves football as a way to shine. There are only 3 FBS schools in this state of 200+ colleges. A rich school like RPI could make the jump to full schollie FCS or FBS if they wanted to. Luckily, I don't think they want to. Still, as Danefan points out, RPI jumping up to D1 FCS would kill some of our exclusivity in the football arena, not to mention wreck our recruiting. We need to ramp up football in a big way as soon as possible. Strike while the iron is hot. College football is wide open in the huge 20 million person state of New York.

 

Move to the Big South now! (Danefan's new name "Big America" conference)