Time for Plan B (stadium)

[Clickclack]

Here is a very comparable project:

 

Southern Illinois Saluki Way

 

http://siusalukis.cstv.com/ot/salukiway.html

 

The stadium will cost $25 million.

 

Really looks like it will be a beautiful facility. Good for them!

[Dane96]

I have been very mum on this subject...mainly because certain admins in our school read this board and I consider them to be good hard-working people who are doing everything they can to move our program forward; I DONT WANT THEM TO TAKE MY THOUGHTS AS A SLIGHT ON WHAT THEY HAVE DONE.

 

That being said, I have lost ALL CONFIDENCE in Dr. McElroy's leadership on this issue. He has done a fine job moving our programs forward with a tight budget, however his handling of the stadium issue is an embarrassment.

 

Look...I have worked as legal counsel for the last 3 1/2 years on construction related projects as far away as Vancouver to as close as where I currently live. This 60 million dollar price tag-- even with the inclusion of the other improvements to SEFCU-- is ridiculous.

 

I am currently working on a project where will re-furbish the ENTIRE CITY OF PITTSBURGH TRANSIT SYSTEM. Our original bid was over 45mm USD. The total price is now 28mm USD because of the market; steel is not as expensive, concrete is not that expensive, and with the use of DBE's (Disadvantaged Business Enterprise) we have much competition for the subcontract work. It is the same all over-- Chicago planned a 500mm - 750mm transit expansion, however that number is more than halved with the current rates.

 

Some will say NY is expensive to build...I will say that is horse pooh. Because of prevailing labor wages, operatiing costs and raw material expenses, my company utilizes 4 business in NY to supply us with less expensive quality work. We utilize businesses in Albany, Rochester, Buffalo and Plattsburgh. ALL OF THESE BUSINESSES HAVE DIRECT CORRELATION TO BUILDING A STADIUM.

 

My point: Dr. McElroy is out of his league right now. Yes, part of this falls on the lack of Presidential leadership to push the Gov. Relations people to highlight the stadium...but that is the final result. You use GR people only to sew up a project. IT IS THE FRONT END LEG WORK THAT WINS THE DOLLARS.

 

There is no way in hell we shouldnt get a 15k seat stadium, with ammenities, for a cost of around 20-28mm in Albany, NY. If I had time...I could probably draft a realistic RFP in about 14 days....but from the background I come from regarding public works projects, agency relations, govt relations, construction costs and the proposal process, in my eyes this WHOLE THING HAS BEEN A MESS FROM THE START. In conversations with some, I wondered why this hasnt gone P3 (public-private partnership).

 

Dr. McElroy is losing alumni support...and frankly those who do a great job of drumming it up (and they know who they are) are being put behind the 8-ball by Dr. McElroy's secretative and bungled process because Alumni are really starting to tire of it. I chat every few months with another out-of-state alumnus who would do anything for the school...and has. He too is just blah with the ADEPT right now. Secrecy builds frustration and apathy...it doesnt drum up MONEY.

 

My .02.

[Clickclack]

I have been very mum on this subject...mainly because certain admins in our school read this board and I consider them to be good hard-working people who are doing everything they can to move our program forward; I DONT WANT THEM TO TAKE MY THOUGHTS AS A SLIGHT ON WHAT THEY HAVE DONE.

 

That being said, I have lost ALL CONFIDENCE in Dr. McElroy's leadership on this issue. He has done a fine job moving our programs forward with a tight budget, however his handling of the stadium issue is an embarrassment.

 

Look...I have worked as legal counsel for the last 3 1/2 years on construction related projects as far away as Vancouver to as close as where I currently live. This 60 million dollar price tag-- even with the inclusion of the other improvements to SEFCU-- is ridiculous.

 

I am currently working on a project where will re-furbish the ENTIRE CITY OF PITTSBURGH TRANSIT SYSTEM. Our original bid was over 45mm USD. The total price is now 28mm USD because of the market; steel is not as expensive, concrete is not that expensive, and with the use of DBE's (Disadvantaged Business Enterprise) we have much competition for the subcontract work. It is the same all over-- Chicago planned a 500mm - 750mm transit expansion, however that number is more than halved with the current rates.

 

Some will say NY is expensive to build...I will say that is horse pooh. Because of prevailing labor wages, operatiing costs and raw material expenses, my company utilizes 4 business in NY to supply us with less expensive quality work. We utilize businesses in Albany, Rochester, Buffalo and Plattsburgh. ALL OF THESE BUSINESSES HAVE DIRECT CORRELATION TO BUILDING A STADIUM.

 

My point: Dr. McElroy is out of his league right now. Yes, part of this falls on the lack of Presidential leadership to push the Gov. Relations people to highlight the stadium...but that is the final result. You use GR people only to sew up a project. IT IS THE FRONT END LEG WORK THAT WINS THE DOLLARS.

 

There is no way in hell we shouldnt get a 15k seat stadium, with ammenities, for a cost of around 20-28mm in Albany, NY. If I had time...I could probably draft a realistic RFP in about 14 days....but from the background I come from regarding public works projects, agency relations, govt relations, construction costs and the proposal process, in my eyes this WHOLE THING HAS BEEN A MESS FROM THE START. In conversations with some, I wondered why this hasnt gone P3 (public-private partnership).

 

Dr. McElroy is losing alumni support...and frankly those who do a great job of drumming it up (and they know who they are) are being put behind the 8-ball by Dr. McElroy's secretative and bungled process because Alumni are really starting to tire of it. I chat every few months with another out-of-state alumnus who would do anything for the school...and has. He too is just blah with the ADEPT right now. Secrecy builds frustration and apathy...it doesnt drum up MONEY.

 

My .02.

 

Very informative post....good read. What can be done to put a rudder on this rudderless ship?

[danefan]

I have been very mum on this subject...mainly because certain admins in our school read this board and I consider them to be good hard-working people who are doing everything they can to move our program forward; I DONT WANT THEM TO TAKE MY THOUGHTS AS A SLIGHT ON WHAT THEY HAVE DONE.

 

That being said, I have lost ALL CONFIDENCE in Dr. McElroy's leadership on this issue. He has done a fine job moving our programs forward with a tight budget, however his handling of the stadium issue is an embarrassment.

 

Look...I have worked as legal counsel for the last 3 1/2 years on construction related projects as far away as Vancouver to as close as where I currently live. This 60 million dollar price tag-- even with the inclusion of the other improvements to SEFCU-- is ridiculous.

 

I am currently working on a project where will re-furbish the ENTIRE CITY OF PITTSBURGH TRANSIT SYSTEM. Our original bid was over 45mm USD. The total price is now 28mm USD because of the market; steel is not as expensive, concrete is not that expensive, and with the use of DBE's (Disadvantaged Business Enterprise) we have much competition for the subcontract work. It is the same all over-- Chicago planned a 500mm - 750mm transit expansion, however that number is more than halved with the current rates.

 

Some will say NY is expensive to build...I will say that is horse pooh. Because of prevailing labor wages, operatiing costs and raw material expenses, my company utilizes 4 business in NY to supply us with less expensive quality work. We utilize businesses in Albany, Rochester, Buffalo and Plattsburgh. ALL OF THESE BUSINESSES HAVE DIRECT CORRELATION TO BUILDING A STADIUM.

 

My point: Dr. McElroy is out of his league right now. Yes, part of this falls on the lack of Presidential leadership to push the Gov. Relations people to highlight the stadium...but that is the final result. You use GR people only to sew up a project. IT IS THE FRONT END LEG WORK THAT WINS THE DOLLARS.

 

There is no way in hell we shouldnt get a 15k seat stadium, with ammenities, for a cost of around 20-28mm in Albany, NY. If I had time...I could probably draft a realistic RFP in about 14 days....but from the background I come from regarding public works projects, agency relations, govt relations, construction costs and the proposal process, in my eyes this WHOLE THING HAS BEEN A MESS FROM THE START. In conversations with some, I wondered why this hasnt gone P3 (public-private partnership).

 

Dr. McElroy is losing alumni support...and frankly those who do a great job of drumming it up (and they know who they are) are being put behind the 8-ball by Dr. McElroy's secretative and bungled process because Alumni are really starting to tire of it. I chat every few months with another out-of-state alumnus who would do anything for the school...and has. He too is just blah with the ADEPT right now. Secrecy builds frustration and apathy...it doesnt drum up MONEY.

 

My .02.

 

Here here. I agree wholeheartedly with you D96. I've seen firsthand what this has done to alumni who used to be very involved.

 

Very well put.

Just read an article yesterday on how construction bids are coming in at 20-30% lower than anticipated right now because of commodities pricing and the lack of work.

[danefan]

Very informative post....good read. What can be done to put a rudder on this rudderless ship?

 

Short of having a major donation withheld I don't know what could be done. I haven't seen anything to suggest that McElroy even cares what we (the fans and alumni) think. Has anyone else? Maybe I'm missing something.

 

No marketing that I have seen.

No public plan.

No clear updates.

No movement in what now seems like 3 years.

 

And this is not a knock on the people who are in the trenches on a daily basis. We see Don Ostrom and his crew pounding the pavement trying to get donations for this project and I appreciate the tough job he has. But who is willing to donate major bucks (or any bucks) to a project that has no promise (or publicized promise at least) of being started, let alone completed.

 

maybe my frustration is just coming out. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I'll get an email from someone in a few minutes telling me I'm wrong. I'll gladly be proven wrong and change my mind on this issue.

[Dane96]

Nope-- your frustration is WELL place.

 

Don Ostrom and Mary Johnson ARE exactly the people busting their butts! Here is the thing: you can tell they hate being cryptic...but they answer to someone above like we all do. I personally am sitting in a position of "they have worked hard...I love my school...I want to cut a check." However, I am at the point where to me the Stadium, our Program, and Bob Ford are where I want my money to go. BUT I AM NOT GOING TO GIVE MONEY UNLESS I KNOW THERE IS A PLAN.

 

There seems to be none. Where are the fly-throughs, plans, etc. My company just had a fly through done in less than a week...with a ten-minute voice over. Budget- 3k. What the hell is the ADEPT doing?

 

Heck, I would even donate to SEFCU scoreboards if I knew McElroy would follow through.

 

Frankly...I am losing faith and inner drive to be a productive sports fan alumni right now.

[danefan]

UAalumn72 - you are one of the people who I consider very knowledgeable and dedicated to the program, yet I haven't seen you comment on the stadium project in a while. Do you have any thoughts? I ask because I think your opinion is valuable and may provide a different perspective.

[Clickclack]

Nope-- your frustration is WELL place.

 

Don Ostrom and Mary Johnson ARE exactly the people busting their butts! Here is the thing: you can tell they hate being cryptic...but they answer to someone above like we all do. I personally am sitting in a position of "they have worked hard...I love my school...I want to cut a check." However, I am at the point where to me the Stadium, our Program, and Bob Ford are where I want my money to go. BUT I AM NOT GOING TO GIVE MONEY UNLESS I KNOW THERE IS A PLAN.

 

There seems to be none. Where are the fly-throughs, plans, etc. My company just had a fly through done in less than a week...with a ten-minute voice over. Budget- 3k. What the hell is the ADEPT doing?

 

Heck, I would even donate to SEFCU scoreboards if I knew McElroy would follow through.

 

Frankly...I am losing faith and inner drive to be a productive sports fan alumni right now.

 

I've asked many of the questions that have come up on this board and the response on more then one occasion has been nothing short of a run around.

 

I've asked why we haven't done any marketing, why there isn't a dedicated site that will inform potential donors of what it is we are trying to do, what we are trying to build, what it will look like, what it will cost etc. The response was....thank you for sharing your thoughts, we'll take it under advisement.

 

I was told that the marketing and concept designs were completed and ready for implementation. No word on when this marketing campaign will actually be rolled out....I asked a number of times, the question get's completely ignored like it wasn't even asked. I understand they owe me NOTHING, doesn't mean I'm any less frustrated with the replies I did get.

 

I did get some clarification on site study and architectural/engineering firms for which I'm grateful. Like someone else said, I don't mean to belittle the efforts of those who are in the trenches doing the work but there is a serious problem with what appears to be complete lack of leadership at the top.

 

This whole thing is a mess and until something about the process is made public, that opinion in unlikely to change.

 

How many potential donors know we are trying to build a stadium? What is the vision towards which they are being asked to give? No one knows....most of us who have followed this project for YEARS have no clue.

[UAalum72]

UAalumn72 - you are one of the people who I consider very knowledgeable and dedicated to the program, yet I haven't seen you comment on the stadium project in a while. Do you have any thoughts? I ask because I think your opinion is valuable and may provide a different perspective.

Nothing new (since the environ. impact meeting last month). Nothing to add.

 

But if you insist ...

 

I do worry that any temporary improvements to University Field would delay a permanent stadium yet another five years. The most I'd go for is building the new running track somewhere else (behind the softball field?) and putting rented bleachers on top of the current track to get them close to the action. I don't have a feel for what the cost of renting 7,000 seats for 12 weeks costs.

 

McElroy did tell me once he's never seen an area like this one for lack of support for an outdoor athletic facility. I don't know if that's why he's leery of putting everything out in the open. If the TU starts talking it down who knows if that scares off what little legislative support we'd have.

[UA_MA_2000]

UAalumn72 - you are one of the people who I consider very knowledgeable and dedicated to the program, yet I haven't seen you comment on the stadium project in a while. Do you have any thoughts? I ask because I think your opinion is valuable and may provide a different perspective.

Nothing new (since the environ. impact meeting last month). Nothing to add.

 

But if you insist ...

 

I do worry that any temporary improvements to University Field would delay a permanent stadium yet another five years. The most I'd go for is building the new running track somewhere else (behind the softball field?) and putting rented bleachers on top of the current track to get them close to the action. I don't have a feel for what the cost of renting 7,000 seats for 12 weeks costs.

 

McElroy did tell me once he's never seen an area like this one for lack of support for an outdoor athletic facility. I don't know if that's why he's leery of putting everything out in the open. If the TU starts talking it down who knows if that scares off what little legislative support we'd have.

 

 

Written submissions following the environmental impact meeting a few weeks ago were due March 31, 2009. That was about only 11 days ago. I also disagree with 99% of the criticism in this thread but won't elaborate on it at this time.

[Dane96]

Why would you make a statement and not elaborate.

 

It would be interesting to hear the other side of the coiin.

[danefan]

UAalumn72 - you are one of the people who I consider very knowledgeable and dedicated to the program, yet I haven't seen you comment on the stadium project in a while. Do you have any thoughts? I ask because I think your opinion is valuable and may provide a different perspective.

Nothing new (since the environ. impact meeting last month). Nothing to add.

 

But if you insist ...

 

I do worry that any temporary improvements to University Field would delay a permanent stadium yet another five years. The most I'd go for is building the new running track somewhere else (behind the softball field?) and putting rented bleachers on top of the current track to get them close to the action. I don't have a feel for what the cost of renting 7,000 seats for 12 weeks costs.

 

McElroy did tell me once he's never seen an area like this one for lack of support for an outdoor athletic facility. I don't know if that's why he's leery of putting everything out in the open. If the TU starts talking it down who knows if that scares off what little legislative support we'd have.

 

 

Written submissions following the environmental impact meeting a few weeks ago were due March 31, 2009. That was about only 11 days ago. I also disagree with 99% of the criticism in this thread but won't elaborate on it at this time.

 

 

 

 

11 days ago and 3 years after it was announced they would due an enivornmental impact statement. See the problem we have?

 

Like I said above, I'd love to be proven wrong on this. I've officially been waiting an entire year to be proven wrong (I jumped the $60 million stadium ship when it wasn't included in last year's budget).

 

We're all waiting for good news.

[Dane96]

Not much to be proven wrong on with this one. It is wrong...period. Between NEPA laws (environmental impact), RFP, contract negotiation, subcontract negotiation, etc.....this stadium is FAR from happening.

 

That is why I am really curious about what UA_MA has to say on this.

 

Sadly, you and I (Danefan)-- along with some others-- have been involved in this process in many ways including direct donation to the stadium, former athletes, and/or relationship with the Coaching staff.

 

We feel it the hardest because sadly we know how this COULD play out-- Coach Ford retiring in frustration and the program falling to mediocrity at best.

[Clickclack]

UAalumn72 - you are one of the people who I consider very knowledgeable and dedicated to the program, yet I haven't seen you comment on the stadium project in a while. Do you have any thoughts? I ask because I think your opinion is valuable and may provide a different perspective.

Nothing new (since the environ. impact meeting last month). Nothing to add.

 

But if you insist ...

 

I do worry that any temporary improvements to University Field would delay a permanent stadium yet another five years. The most I'd go for is building the new running track somewhere else (behind the softball field?) and putting rented bleachers on top of the current track to get them close to the action. I don't have a feel for what the cost of renting 7,000 seats for 12 weeks costs.

 

McElroy did tell me once he's never seen an area like this one for lack of support for an outdoor athletic facility. I don't know if that's why he's leery of putting everything out in the open. If the TU starts talking it down who knows if that scares off what little legislative support we'd have.

 

 

Written submissions following the environmental impact meeting a few weeks ago were due March 31, 2009. That was about only 11 days ago. I also disagree with 99% of the criticism in this thread but won't elaborate on it at this time.

 

I hope you are correct and I'm dead wrong on this issue, nothing would please me more!

[Dane96]

And let's not forget...I do believe (based on flow down requirements), SEQR has to be conformed to (another part of DEIS). This thing is FAR from complete...and a public push should be made.