US News & World Report

[statefan]

The 2005 US New & World Report national university rankings are out and we're no wheres to be found. The cite is http://www.usnews.com/usnews/edu/college/r...tudoc_brief.php

 

6 fellow America East schools are on the list:

Boston U 56

Binghamton 74

Vermont 90

New Hampshire 98

Stony Brook 106

Northeastern 120

 

While the Princeton Review rankings, by itself, was a source of amusement; combined with this , I feel , is a reason for concern. The budgetary cuts imposed by Gov Pataki and Chancellor King, together with running Pres Hitchcock and Provost Santiago out of here are the essential causes. The University needs to return to its basic mission and stop pandering to those who throw money at the Nanotech Center.

[UAalum72]

The 2005 US New & World Report national university rankings are out and we're no wheres to be found.  The cite is  http://www.usnews.com/usnews/edu/college/r...tudoc_brief.php

SUNY-Albany At-a-glance says we're National University, third tier

[DaneFan2k3]

PS - third tier is pretty much not good. That's really bad for a school that calls itself a national calibur school.

 

"National University" simply means they offer a substantial number of PhD programs. Being in that category isn't a show of strength based on academics, it's all based on the programs you have to offer. "Those in the National Universities group are the 248 American universities (162 public and 86 private) that offer a wide range of undergraduate majors as well as master's and doctoral degrees; many strongly emphasize research."

 

For example, I browed through the "Universities - Master's" category and Villanova, Providence, RIT, Loyola, etc. are lumped in there because they offer multiple master's level degrees but not enough PhD programs for the "National University" rankings.

 

There are 129 "Top Schools" in the national university category.

 

UAlbany is lumped in with the next 57 schools, unranked (alphabetically) to spare that group some shame (that is not pessimism, I look at these yearly and that's why they don't rank outside the top tier). In order to focus on the best schools, U.S. News publishes the numbered rank of approximately the top 50 percent of schools in all the categories. The remaining schools are placed in tiers or broad groups, based on their overall score in their category, (the third and fourth tiers) and listed alphabetically.

 

So UAlbany could be 130th, or they could be 186th. Likely they are somewhere in-between. There are 248 total in the National University classification, meaning at best they ranked UAlbany ahead of 47.58% of their peers, or at worst only ahead of 25%.

 

If anyone subscribed or has the print version and can look up our peer assessment score, I would be interested to know.

 

They only show the first two tier three scores, and they are 2.0 and 2.3 out of 5.0, not good.

 

Even though this is, admittedly on their part, only one way to judge colleges, it does show that the University isn't exactly what it's claiming to be. They're a long way off from being a "top" school, unless by "top" you mean "top 48%".

[Ruler]

People are making too much of these rankings. If you are not going to an Ivy League School or graduated from one, then you are at a second, third, or fourth tier school. In the real world they really don't care about degrees from schools beyond the Ivy's, Duke, MIT, Stanford, etc. Even schools like Union, Hamilton, Bates, and Colby have better reps then Albany.

 

Albany is a State School....Period!!!! It's not private and it does not, nor did it ever carry the weight of a top tier school like many of you are stating. Hell, we ranked dead last of the 4 SUNYS.

 

 

Face The Facts!

[DaneFan2k3]

Tell that to the administration which continually attempts to portray the school as "the next coming".

 

The rankings matter for what they point out, if not for the actual ranking aspect. If your school continually ranks low or falls further in the rankings, it points out that your school is not doing what it should be doing to keep up in a continuously adapting and competitive environment.

 

Either your school is getting worse, or other schools are passing you by in key measures of excellence, and neither one of those things is good.

 

I don't agree that employers look past your school when looking at your degree. This seems to be a common theme among people, but if you're telling me that someone from UAlbany vs. someone from a well-known school in the Top 50 or even Top 100 go head to head, with the same major, grades, and extracuriculars ... I think it matters at that point.

 

If a school is well-known or well-respected in your field (or even overall) and you're from a school the hiring person doesn't know much about, you're at a disadvantage.

[reeder]

I graduated from UA almost 20 years ago and have worked for 3 companies in that period. Not once has anyone focused on where I went to school. I do have an MBA from another school but no one focuses on that either. The irony is that when you are outside of the northeast many people have never heard of UA. I think that when you first graduate and are looking for a job in the NY area people may have an opinion of a UA grad but after a couple years experience no one cares.

 

Unless you went to Harvard, your college means very little as your professional credentials builld up. That is what people look at when they hire you. I couldn't tell you where most of the people in my business unit went to school - it doesn't matter because they're hired based on their skills and experience and they are successful because they deliver.

[DaneFan2k3]

I totally agree, but fresh out of college I think that most people can agree it does affect your chances, especially if you're going up against a candidate or candidates who have gone to more well-respected schools.

 

Then again, when famous people are profiled, they don't write "the Harvard-educated (insert profession here)" for nothing...

 

------------

Like I said, it's more of what the rankings indicate than the actual ranking: If you are slipping because your endowment numbers are falling or remain stagnant, if you're falling because your professor retention rate is terrible, if you're falling because the student retention or graduation rate is terrible, etc. etc. down the line ... those are telling stats. Students should probably think twice about schools like that.

[Dane96]

I agree, that in the short run where you went to school makes a difference. If you have any connections, however, that definately will change the playing field. I am finding this out right now.....having not graduated BC, BU, or HAAHVAHD, I can't even get a sniff of a job and I have some decent credentials.

 

As for the rankings, I had a meeting this afternoon with a bunch of people in the collegiate business. I had a chance to peruse the rankings. As they did with the law school rankings, USNWR should be ashamed of itself. Do I think UA is a TOP 75 school...no not yet. However after reviewing the hardcopy and talking to people who work w/ those making the rankings...these are arbitrary rankings at best (though I agree w/ D2k that it does influence people).

 

A state school such as UA that is in a state with a large populus will be penalized based on admission rate; Texas and Cali schools aside (they are more established and more well known). The large penalization comes for Student:Faculty ratio. Too me...that is horse$iena. Who cares if the classes are large....if you want to get to meet the professor you go be an adult and make an appointment.

 

What is comical, is that I stopped counting at 40, as in 40 schools ranked ahead of us with worse SAT scores and worse GPA, top of class.

 

This is exactly why the University presidents at both the undergrad and grad level have railed these rankings, though admittedly they have become unfortunately important, maybe more important than the traditional high school "college advisor."

 

If you dare try to tell me anything at Peppardine is better than any of the four SUNY's....you must be smoking some good $iena from Humboldt Cnty. I have numerous family members attend that school and I nearly went there for law school. It is good for what it is....a religious West Coast private school. The fact that it is tied with GW is even more disgusting. Fordham behind UCONN....without a IA sports program Storrs would be a boring school w/ ok academics. You walk into any business in NY/CONN and ask them will they hire an equal Fordham or UCONN grad....and they would laugh the UCONN grad all the way back to Storrs.

 

Now I am not knocking a school of our state, however the fact that the COLLEGE OF FORESTY is 98.....are you kidding? Who goes there? Kids who want to work in the envirornment or want to play college sports. It may be a good forestry school...but it is certainly not a NATIONAL UNIVERSITY...and certainly does not attract a better student than any of the four centers or even the best "college" in our system (ie. non-university center).....GENESEO.

 

Drexel in the Top 100...that is fat laugh....the school is barely afloat. If the U of Dayton is in there, then St Johns should be there too. They practically beg students to come from out of state.

 

All in all, the best thing I learned in law school is to think about what the writer or opinon maker wants as they have written their thoughts. USNWR is not unbiased, in fact that is the major point of contention with administrators.

 

UA needs to do some serious housekeeping, however a school that has SAT and GPA scores above 40 schools ahead of it....well, what else could you want?

[Ruler]

To Dane 96

 

 

I have some very good connections(they are clients) at Skadden Arps, and Baker McKenzie in D.C. If you have an intrest let me know. I believe at worst could probably get you an interview. I also have a former Albany football player and hoop player who is not only one of my best friends but also a U.S. Attorney. Let me know.

[Dane Pound]

Dane96 if you get hired because of a tip on this board I get 10% of your first year's salary.

[DaneFan2k3]

Just out of curiosity, how did you get our SAT and class rank, GPA, etc. Did you buy the online edition or the actual magazine? Or are you going off of previous knowledge? It wasn't shown on the "Free" online version of the rankings, so I was just curious.

 

(referring to "What is comical, is that I stopped counting at 40, as in 40 schools ranked ahead of us with worse SAT scores and worse GPA, top of class. ")

 

I think those are good measures of the students, but not the overall education at Albany.

 

They take other things into consideration, like peer assessment, retention (which can be a measure of kids failing out, not liking campus, or finding out that the program stinks, or just generally not liking the school), faculty resources, financial resources, graduation rate, alumni giving rate.

 

I have to think that these are the areas where Albany failed the most. Faculty resources, I know for a fact, are lacking (except in certain majors). Retention likely isn't as high as some of our "peers". Alumni giving rate is certain to be much lower than some of our peers.

 

I think all of that adds up to us being rated lower than our GPA, rank and SAT would normally place Albany.