[MBB] Game #17: 1/12/19 - 3:00PM vs Maine

[Eli]

Funny quote though.

[Dane06grad]

3 hours ago, nysteve661 said:

Went back to the 09-10 team that was 7-25, 2-14 in AE, the last disaster of a season and looked at the roster.   It was a mismatch of parts that had no prayer of succeeding.  Hoping that the future of this team ( with possible new parts getting mixed in) can succeed quicker than that team which took 3 years to get an AE title.

09-10 Roster:

Will Harris-- as a UVA transfer was a huge disappointment 

Logan Aronhalt,John Puk, Mike Black, Blake Metcalf were all Freshman

Tim Ambrose was exciting but NO  defense 

Derek Tartt, Ralph Watts, Jake Lindfors, Fran Urli were all head cases with one foot out the door while here

Jacob Iati, Brett Gifford, Scotty McCrae,  Billy Allen, Mike Johnson all were role players who represented UA well but each had limited skill sets

The 09-10 team was a total disaster but it had one thing that this team doesn't... Athleticsm and talent. They could beat anyone on any given night, they just didn't. Except Vermont in the tourney at home!!

I always found Tim Ambrose to be such a peculiar story. All the talent in the world, yes no D in Tim, but always seemed like a decent teammate. played hard, showed up. Maybe I am forgetting things because it has been so long. I can never figure out if the teams he was on couldn't win or he was the reason the teams couldn't win. 

[Dane Pound]

4 hours ago, nysteve661 said:

Went back to the 09-10 team that was 7-25, 2-14 in AE, the last disaster of a season and looked at the roster.   It was a mismatch of parts that had no prayer of succeeding.  Hoping that the future of this team ( with possible new parts getting mixed in) can succeed quicker than that team which took 3 years to get an AE title.

09-10 Roster:

Will Harris-- as a UVA transfer was a huge disappointment 

Logan Aronhalt,John Puk, Mike Black, Blake Metcalf were all Freshman

Tim Ambrose was exciting but NO  defense 

Derek Tartt, Ralph Watts, Jake Lindfors, Fran Urli were all head cases with one foot out the door while here

Jacob Iati, Brett Gifford, Scotty McCrae,  Billy Allen, Mike Johnson all were role players who represented UA well but each had limited skill sets

I disagree with some of this. Billy Allen was good until he was injured. Jacob Iati was redshirting that year after transferring from High Point (I think.)

My takeaway from that 09-10 year was that our freshman class (Black, Metcalf and Puk) took their lumps that year but became the foundation of a really good run. They won 9 more games the next year (16-16) and finished their senior year knocking off Washington and then playing Duke at Well Fargo in the NCAA tourney. I'm under no illusions about this year but I hope that's where we're headed with this group.

[nysteve661]

21 minutes ago, Dane Pound said:

I disagree with some of this. Billy Allen was good until he was injured. Jacob Iati was redshirting that year after transferring from High Point (I think.)

My takeaway from that 09-10 year was that our freshman class (Black, Metcalf and Puk) took their lumps that year but became the foundation of a really good run. They won 9 more games the next year (16-16) and finished their senior year knocking off Washington and then playing Duke at Well Fargo in the NCAA tourney. I'm under no illusions about this year but I hope that's where we're headed with this group.

Yes Iati was a RS but Allen played in 30 games, avg 12 min, 3 pts, and shot 31% from 3.  The freshmen did progress well but hoping this group doesn't  need 3 years to get there.  Would be great to see them playing in an AE title game by junior year.  All depends who stays, who goes , and which parts CB gets to compliment them.

[dslyank]

18 hours ago, UA_MA_2000 said:

I re-watched the game today, and I think Lauderdale was a bright spot. 

Since athleticism and strength are clearly a problem out there, what about this lineup:

F - Lulka

F - Lauderdale 

F - Campbell 

G - Miller

G - Clark

With these 5 on the floor, I don't expect a miracle, but I am so tired of seeing us throw away passes or getting the ball ripped away due to being out-muscled. I think Lauderdale is tough, and his footwork down on the post looks quicker and improved.

I don't exactly buy the freshman excuse because several kids who are getting playing time are at least in year 2 of a college program and, presumably, its strength and conditioning program. 

WOW. You are certainly entitled to your opinions; but wow IMHO you are way off base with this line-up. #1Lauderdale has about as much mobility as the statue of liberty and lady liberty has better hands! Miller was brought here for senior/grad leadership and +½ way through the season has shown 0. He was a walk-on at Umass that worked his way into a scholie and some major minutes, but my guess he lacks the athleticism and/or desire as a short termer to make that same sort of effort again? As for Campbell, we can argue him all day long, but he has regressed (whether his O affected his D or vice versa) the past two years. Give him some minutes out of loyalty, but start NOT.

So I hope you do not take my disagreements personally. Hey, I am the idiot that suggested playing Fruscio [and got hammered for it.] This team needs something, who knows maybe your line-up works or maybe nothing works this year????

Edited January 14, 2019 by dslyank

[DanesRGood]

I missed the game and refuse to watch the replay but from what I've read here and in reports it was ugly. I've said it in other threads on here, I did not think conference play would go well.  Did I think it'd be so bad we would lose to Maine? No. But I was prepared for bottom half of the conference and a first round loss in the tourney as I referenced in the second Dartmouth game thread.  I do however think that this roster can win. I think some posters here are going overboard with how bad they think the level of players are on the roster. We've seen it take a year for Juco's to "get it". We've seen freshman struggle. Normally our freshman have time to learn behind some experienced upperclassmen, we do not have that right now. Every coach misses on some recruits and Brown and staff may have missed on a few of these, which will happen when you are forced to fill so many spots in one year(they have to reach).  On the other hand, I do not see or think that the staff could miss badly on so many.  That is why I have hope.  Especially for next year and the year after. 

Go back and look at the freshman seasons of our previous stars and first year for our best Jucos.  There are only a few who had even mild success. Now imagine if the team they played on was filled with other freshman and jucos in their first year and this is what you get.  I knew this season was going to be rough after watching the team in the OOC but as I've said over and over and over on this board, I just keep telling myself to be patient, let these kids grow, let them get experience and wait until next year. As I've also said, I really hope I'm wrong and Brown figures out a way to turn this around this year but again, I just don't see.  Just WAY too much inexperience on the court. 

 

 

 

[Clickclack]

21 minutes ago, DanesRGood said:

I missed the game and refuse to watch the replay but from what I've read here and in reports it was ugly. I've said it in other threads on here, I did not think conference play would go well.  Did I think it'd be so bad we would lose to Maine? No. But I was prepared for bottom half of the conference and a first round loss in the tourney as I referenced in the second Dartmouth game thread.  I do however think that this roster can win. I think some posters here are going overboard with how bad they think the level of players are on the roster. We've seen it take a year for Juco's to "get it". We've seen freshman struggle. Normally our freshman have time to learn behind some experienced upperclassmen, we do not have that right now. Every coach misses on some recruits and Brown and staff may have missed on a few of these, which will happen when you are forced to fill so many spots in one year(they have to reach).  On the other hand, I do not see or think that the staff could miss badly on so many.  That is why I have hope.  Especially for next year and the year after. 

Go back and look at the freshman seasons of our previous stars and first year for our best Jucos.  There are only a few who had even mild success. Now imagine if the team they played on was filled with other freshman and jucos in their first year and this is what you get.  I knew this season was going to be rough after watching the team in the OOC but as I've said over and over and over on this board, I just keep telling myself to be patient, let these kids grow, let them get experience and wait until next year. As I've also said, I really hope I'm wrong and Brown figures out a way to turn this around this year but again, I just don't see.  Just WAY too much inexperience on the court. 

 

 

 

I'm with you, I thought this would be a .500 or less season, obviously there is almost no question it's going to be a sub .500 season and possible single digit wins. Like you I like the core of this team. I however don't like any of the JUCO kids, I think the majority of them were a major reach. IMO, the Cremo and Nichols departure resulted in a reach for players that I don't think otherwise we'd reach for to fill a roster. Brooks, Jerotic, Miller...Starks injured and career over, Laurderdale is barely serviceable, French isn't good, Flory is way behind. There is no way to overcome with this young a roster THIS many misses or injuries in addition to trying to get 4 freshman to give you anything. Next year WILL be better, some of these kids won't be here. I'm praying that a 4 year PG is recruited to groom behind Clark for one year and take over for 3. We need one more wing and one more big that can finish around the rim and maybe a hint of back to the basket game. 

I really like Healey when we get a kid or two that can slash, I like Lulka as he develops and I like Hanks who by the time he's a junior will be a nice complimentary starter. But honestly we are probably looking at these kids being able to compete for AE 'chip by the time this freshman class are juniors. Bringing in more JUCO's isn't going to solve the problem, this needs to be a bottom up build with 4 year kids developed and groomed in house. I truly believe we have the makings of that with Healey, Rizzuto, Lulka and Hanks to go along with Hutchesonand Doherty. I would feel a ton better if we found a 4 year core PG to go along with that core. I don't know what to make of De Sousa...I'd like to think he's part of the core but not sure. 

A kid like Greg Dolan of the City Rocks would be a nice addition to this core, 6'3 PG with good vision and passing...would need to get a lot stronger but could play behind Clark next year for 10-12 minutes. 

Edited January 14, 2019 by Clickclack

[UA'08]

13 minutes ago, Clickclack said:

A kid like Greg Dolan of the City Rocks would be a nice addition to this core, 6'3 PG with good vision and passing...would need to get a lot stronger but could play behind Clark next year for 10-12 minutes. 

Who was the last city rock kid we landed? Fruscio then Jordan? Seems like Siena has the in locally with them. 

[uofalbany]

Safe to say year number 4 after our last AE championship will not be a championship year.  Any bets when we’ll see our next ‘chip?  

‘21, ‘22, ‘23, ‘30?

Long time to wait just for a one and done.

 

 

[DanesRGood]

32 minutes ago, Clickclack said:

I however don't like any of the JUCO kids, I think the majority of them were a major reach. IMO, the Cremo and Nichols departure resulted in a reach for players that I don't think otherwise we'd reach for to fill a roster. Brooks, Jerotic, Miller...Starks injured and career over, Laurderdale is barely serviceable, French isn't good, Flory is way behind.

I'm not giving up on any of these kids yet, maybe Miller since he's a goner after this season.  How did DJ Evans look his first season?  I'll tell you, terrible.  

I'm sure you are correct on a couple but I honestly don't think we will know for sure until next year.

[Clickclack]

Just now, DanesRGood said:

I'm not giving up on any of these kids yet, maybe Miller since he's a goner after this season.  How did DJ Evans look his first season?  I'll tell you, terrible.  

I'm sure you are correct on a couple but I honestly don't think we will know for sure until next year.

I can at least see where some of these kids could contribute...however on Brooks I'm totally miffed. 

[uofalbany]

Curious about what everyone thinks would be happening if cremo and nichols were on the team this year?

Do you think we would have had a chance at the chip or another flop?              

[godanesgo99]

4 minutes ago, uofalbany said:

Curious about what everyone thinks would be happening if cremo and nichols were on the team this year?

Do you think we would have had a chance at the chip or another flop?              

Not sure it would be much different at the end of the day. The OOC record would be better. We would be favored to be a top 3 in the league. We would still be weak with the bigs hoping that the youth would do more than they are capable for as freshman. 

[Clickclack]

6 minutes ago, uofalbany said:

Curious about what everyone thinks would be happening if cremo and nichols were on the team this year?

Do you think we would have had a chance at the chip or another flop?              

I think we'd be very very good...Clark, Healey and Rizzuto would all come off the bench. Still not good enough as we don't have the bigs but would be a good team. 

[godanesgo99]

Realize what we are saying here now: Adding 2 players that are playing significant time for Villanova and Florida State that already know our system to this team would not be enough to have a great shot at the league title.... That shows how down the fan base is at the moment. 

Also, given the above: what should we be expecting from Rayshawn Miller who played 25 minutes per game last season in the A10, and Phil Flory who was a walk-on that played limited time last season in the Big East? At the end of the day, those were the 2 players we brought in late to replace Cremo and Nichols. 

I still think we will be good this year. We really just need the light switch to go on for two of the following: deSousa, French, Brooks, Lauderdale, or Flory. I think if 2 of those guys can do something to earn Brown's trust and start getting some significant playing time the team will end up very good and will surprise the league for the second half of conference play. If only one of them does, the team will be better, but still end up losing a first round game, if none of them do - we might miss the AE playoffs.