UA vs. Siena

[Dane96]

Bob...let me keep it simple.

 

If this game dips below 10,000 fans...both SCHOOLS WILL CANCEL THE SERIES. I would bet the little money I have on this.

 

TRUST ME ON THIS ONE! I think I have earned that trust that I know what I am talking about. The financial windfall is not found at either school and SIENA is not making out like banditos-- that is all I have to say. Read between the lines.

 

Is that what you want? NO.

 

So we need every fan in the seats for the next three years.

[Dane96]

Dane Pound...clear out your IN BOX...got a PM for you.

[bob87]

Bob...let me keep it simple.

 

If this game dips below 10,000 fans...both SCHOOLS WILL CANCEL THE SERIES. I would bet the little money I have on this.

 

TRUST ME ON THIS ONE! I think I have earned that trust that I know what I am talking about. The financial windfall is not found at either school and SIENA is not making out like banditos-- that is all I have to say. Read between the lines.

 

Is that what you want? NO.

 

So we need every fan in the seats for the next three years.

 

 

If you ask the question at least let me answer.

 

 

Is that what you want?

 

I could care less one way or the other. This isn't the be all and end all game to be. It is just one of about 30 on the schedule and If Albany is not getting what I perceive to be fair I would just assume skip it.

 

 

"If this game dips below 10,000 fans...both SCHOOLS WILL CANCEL THE SERIES."

 

I don't have a problem with that.

[Dane96]

Well Bob...there you have it. I am glad you are not our athletic director.

 

Until you can guarantee me another 40k game at the 'Cue...and guarantee the kids will play in front of 13,000 fans in their home city...I WANT THE GAME.

[quackman]

[olddog,

 

You and I have had this discussion via PM, and I'm sure you know that I respect your opinion immensely. I only ask you to do one thing for me....put yourself in Siena's position, would you voluntarily give the agreement that so obviously favors you? Spin it around.....if we were the program with 30 years of D1 tradition, double the average home game attendance, played our games at the TUC and owned a 6 out of 7 W-L record. Would we give up the farm?

 

I'm not happy about this deal, the terms do NOT satisfy me, we are NOT even close to equity and I can't find fault in really any of your reasons. For selfish reasons, I don't want to let this game go by the waste side. I don't want to end the series having lost 6 out of 7.....I don't want to end the series when it looks like we couldn't cut it so we slinked away. Holding a gun to their head and saying....split it or we walk will get the thing canceled. The equity in basketball will come, but it will take time as they aren't going to just give it up. If it doesn't come then the game won't continue.

 

bosiydid,

 

You and I agree on one issue - the game needs to be continued.

 

You still have not convinced me that Siena has that much leverage over us. Let me address some of your points.

 

I could care not less if Siena has more Division I experience than us. In all other sports, their longevity has not helped them in competition vis-a-vis UA. Though we have less than 1/3 the longevity in Division I than they have, our teams are superior. Yet, we continue to schedule them in many other sports, and we continue to give them the same respect as we would any other Division I team with home-and-away series, and the ticket sales that accrue from those events. Yes, the revenue is not the same as from basketball, but the operative word here is "respect." Longevity is not a good argument for you.

 

Yes, Siena did get about twice as many fans to their games as we did to ours. Remember, for one thing, last year was a good year for their team, our team did not fare as well. The general trend over the last few years, however, does not support the fact that Siena will be able to maintain that ratio. If they have a bad season, their ticket receipts will decline. On the contrary, over the last decade, despite recent success, Siena's fanbase, despite their recent success, has been declining. Ours has grown exponentially. Fanbase size is less of an argument for me than it is for you.

 

Are you really serious to think that Siena would walk away from a game in which it has sold 6,500 tickets and shared expenses to put on the game?

By the way, I have not stated unequivocably that UA and Siena must split everything down the middle in order to continue the series. I only postulated that possibility as theory to illustrate true equity. I still believe that Siena would be foolish, however, to discontinue the series if they were [Note the use of the subjunctive mood here.] the home team every other year. For instance, as has been reported over on the Siena board, Roger Wyland is supposed to have said that UA will be the home team in the 2009 game. If that is the case, then the real agreement is far closer to what I would consider an equitable contract than what I believed yesterday afternoon and this morning.

 

I still believe that UA has far more leverage in this series than you give it credit for.

 

Without reading all of the posts on this ...

 

I still say the same thing. Both programs need to do what is right for them. Neither owes anything to the other, they are direct competitors for the attention of the local market. Siena has no duty to be "fair" to UAlbany, UAlbany has no duty to be "fair" to Siena. Both have to decide how important the game is to their respective program and then weight the benefits/issues with the proposed contracts.

 

Obviously, UAlbany decided that the increased financial and cosmetic terms were sufficient to continue the series. Conversely, Siena obviously decided that the concessions they had to give outweighed any other issues they might have. While I don't think having a strong UAlbany down the street is bad for Siena, I'm sure Siena is congnizant of one of the major outcomes for both schools is increased local attention, if only for the week of the game. Siena already garners more local attention than Albany ... sharing the spotlight with a competitor is a double edged sword. Perhaps it a chicken or the egg issue, but there is a reason why Siena gets more attention ... because it has more fans locally.

 

Personally, I was not in favor of the game when it was first scheduled as I thought the game benefited Albany more than Siena. After 7 games, I have come to really enjoy the game/rivalry and am glad that both programs could come up with mutually agreeable terms.

 

As always, I wish the Danes luck in the coming seasons and hope that their touted freshman class can live up to the high expectations.

[quackman]

Well Bob...there you have it. I am glad you are not our athletic director.

 

Until you can guarantee me another 40k game at the 'Cue...and guarantee the kids will play in front of 13,000 fans in their home city...I WANT THE GAME.

 

Exactly, dane96, you hit it on the head. It's an "away" game that every one of your fans can get to. What is better than that? It is a local game that garners more attention that any other on your schedule (as it does Siena) at a time when the program is still trying to find it's niche within the local market. (The program has grown unbelieveable in the last 7 years, which is truly a testament to McElroy (who I like) and Brown (who I don't like)) It costs Albany nothing to play this game but still gets a great pay day.

[uofalbany]

Apparently, section 104 is for UAlbany. What other sections will we be given?

At least we have a baby section behind our team, and 500 additional seats overall.

It's an additonal 10k in our pocket.

Well, it's an improvement.

 

We all agree, our team deserves support.

 

D96, that's a very convenient clause in siena's contract with the pepsi... meaning we never get the home game in that fashion.

 

I certainly understand the historical concept of sustaining sellouts before televising sporting events.

If an event is available on tv, then maybe it would pull some fans out of the arena.

 

Another perspective is that having a game such as this on espn, would increase the perception that this is a BIG TIME game, or else it wouldn't be on espn. And although it is televised, it's one game that CAN'T be missed in person. It might stir up so much more interest, that it causes the tuc to sell out.

 

I think we are already heading for sellouts, imo, as it is now.

 

I'm not really looking for the game on espn, or expect anyone to be working on it, but I'd like to draw as much attention to this game, to anyone and to anywhere that we can. The greater the exposure, the greater the benefits for everyone and everything involved. I'm just imagining and getting excited about how nice it will be if our rivalry game becomes important enough to make it on espn.

 

[Clickclack]

I know we have the endzone seats.....102, 101, 130 and so on. I'm not sure how far it swings around though. Have we always had section 103?

[UAalum72]

Apparently, section 104 is for UAlbany. What other sections will we be given?

Since theysaid no Siena season ticket holders will be displaced, it's probably most of the sections under the tarps.

[KingDane]

No one will take this seriously, but since I probably spend as much effort and money as anyone getting to Albany annually to see the game from the end zone, I'll take the liberty of giving my opinion.

 

Regardless of history, the game belongs to the community. In the Div III days it was a home and home so this was not an issue. Since the renewal of the rivalry, with only one game a year, it should be a neutral event, equitable seating and revenue. The game should not be in Siena's season ticket package.

 

The games have been close, since the rivalry renewed we've been to the tournament twice, they've been once. We're 0-2, they are 1-1.

 

I was hoping for a better deal, but it looks disappointing. Let Siena schedule another school that gives them 13,000 asses in seats for a few years. Let's go separate ways for awhile and in three or four years we'll see who benefits from the game more.

[I rock(ed) the Cape]

anyone still taking the under on the total number of pages being six? lol

[statefan]

There were a couple of other points made in Coach Brown's interview with Wyland that i have not seen referred to here thus far.

 

1. Although the second game is called a home game, it only means that we wear the home uniforms and are referred to as the home team on the scoreboard. The game remains a home game for Siena on their season ticket package and the Siena floor remains.

 

2. Referees must be referees who work both AE and MAAC games (so, I guess that means no Will Bush)

 

3. The game will be a 7 PM game.

 

The remainder of this post should be considered opinion and not necessarily fact. It sounded to me that Coach was not thrilled with this contract, but was obligated to support it. He stated more than once that he desired the game to be a stand alone special event, and not to be sold on either school's season ticket package. My inference from this is that he felt that each school should sell as much as it can; then divide the proceeds , after payment of the rent and related costs proportionately to the tickets you sell.

 

On a personal level,I would go to this game even if Siena kept 100% of the revenue and I sat in the worst seat in the house, and I do understand that we stand to make as much money per game under this contract as we have for many of the "guarantee" games we've played over the past years, and I have always placed my faith in Lee McElroy to make the best decision for the University, and I realize that Siena's success last season reduces our bargaining position; nevertheless, I feel we did not make as good of a deal as was possible. Despite what is posted on this and on the Siena board, this game represents Siena's biggest net payday of their season, and, accordingly it is hard for me to believe they would have walked away. I am not too happy, but it is done and set and I'm not going to give it another thought for three more years.

[danefan]

anyone still taking the under on the total number of pages being six? lol

 

 

I suck at betting. I set the over at 7. good thing we didn't wager. I'm already knee deep in $iena for the train-wreck of a NCAA bracket I put together.

[Clickclack]

anyone still taking the under on the total number of pages being six? lol

 

 

I suck at betting. I set the over at 7. good thing we didn't wager. I'm already knee deep in $iena for the train-wreck of a NCAA bracket I put together.

 

I won $200 at work but more importantly....kicked your collective a$$es!

[haggyland]

I won $200 at work but more importantly....kicked your collective a$$es!

There's no pride in chalk betting.

When you go to the race track do you bet the 3/5 to show?

 

Just kidding. Maybe.